Gamblers say web shop failed to pay out thousands

One of the tickets showing the Iowa draw.

As of Wednesday, July 5, 2017

By KHRISNA VIRGIL

Deputy Chief Reporter

kvirgil@tribunemedia.net

IRATE patrons of Paradise Games, a local web shop, yesterday vowed to “take their business elsewhere” amid accusations the gaming house has refused to reward tens of thousands of dollars in winnings.

The customers, on the request of anonymity, allege after playing numbers and winning nearly $60,000 on one ticket and another $32,000 on an additional ticket in house ‘Early Iowa’, they were “given the run around” by Paradise Games and ultimately told there were “problems” with issuing the money.

The three construction workers also told The Tribune they suspected the gaming house simply did not want to pay them because the sum of money is substantial. These suspicions rose when ‘Early Iowa’s’ drawings were no longer visible on the web shop’s website, the men said.

They explained the winnings were substantial because of a “pooling system” among at least ten people.

However, Kevin Knowles, Paradise Games’ owner, defended his company saying it has no issues with paying customers once they win “fair and square.”

Mr Knowles admitted to The Tribune his gaming house was forced to remove houses Iowa and Indiana pending an investigation after the “lotteries teamed up and posted identical results unbeknownst” to the company.

According to Mr Knowles, about $180,000 was being disputed up to yesterday.

He said officials at the Gaming Board were made aware of the issues and it was expected the matter would be resolved sometime Wednesday.

“We played in Early Iowa and after visiting the web shop yesterday (Monday) we were told to come back because the workers in the shop were changing shifts,” one of the men said in an interview at The Tribune yesterday. “We waited around and still were not able to get our money. We were told to return this (Tuesday) morning.

“When we returned at around 7am, we tried until at least 12pm and still nothing. All we were told was that there were problems. But we want to know what the problem is. We have the receipt that shows the number and this ticket says that Paradise Games says they will honour this receipt. That’s two days of work we already missed to get our money.

“The number came and on the United States’ lottery post website the number is there, but it is no longer on Paradise Games’ website and it’s not on the print out of numbers that have already fallen.

“You know why? Because they don’t want to pay us our money. They think it’s too much money to be paying out.”

However, Mr Knowles vigorously disputed this assertion, saying his business would not have been successful if it didn’t pay patrons the money they win.

He explained: “Two of the lotteries teamed up and then posted the same results unbeknownst to us. Iowa and Indiana showed the same results. We took them down pending the investigation.

“These guys are claiming they won $180,000 not $100, but it is $180,000 they are trying to get.

“One (ticket claims winnings) of $50,000 and two is $31,000 and then there were a bunch of other payouts. We are doing the investigation and we have alerted the Gaming Board, so they are aware of it.

“The matter will be concluded tomorrow.”

Mr Knowles added: “We wouldn’t be operating if we didn’t pay our customers. We don’t want to try and keep anyone’s funds away from them. That wouldn’t be good for business at all. If we owe them we pay them.

“It’s not the amount of the money (that is the issue). If they won it fair and square they would have been paid yesterday on the spot.”

Officials at the Gaming Board said yesterday there was a process to be followed in issues such as this, adding multiple patrons complained about problems receiving payouts from Paradise Games.

One official said from a legal perspective, the Gaming Act provides a mechanism for patrons who are aggrieved by gaming house operators to seek redress through the board and this process commences through a written complaint.

Patrons must also produce proof to show they purchased a particular number.

Once this is done, an interview with the both operator and patron is carried out.

The Gaming Board then arrives at a preliminary determination, of which both the patron and operator is notified.

Should either remain dissatisfied, officials said recourse can be sought in court.

sealice 6 years, 9 months ago

by the time the courts get to it the numbers so faded on the ticket no one gets schit....

Sickened 6 years, 9 months ago

The problem Paradise Games has with Iowa and Indiana has nothing to do with the patrons they sold the tickets to. Are they really saying that the Iowa lottery and Indiana lottery teamed up unexpectedly to help these few Bahamians win money?

Well_mudda_take_sic 6 years, 9 months ago

Bahamians playing numbers are being ripped off and made fools of every day. Since the 'legalization' of the online gaming web shops, the numbers' bosses are proving that crime does indeed pay and they have re-rigged the odds on payouts to Bahamians stupid enough to continue placing bets so as to ensure the 'House' now makes super profits, of the kind never before made. Only a true fool would give a web shop a dollar these days!

DaGoobs 6 years, 9 months ago

The Gaming Board needs to be authorized to resolve these types of matters through binding arbitration. As matters currently stand, a court suit would take a long time and even longer with appeals, possibly all the way to the Privy Council if the decision goes against the deep pockets webshop owners. Maybe they can send the matter to the Utilities Appeal Tribunal who are not doing much of anything these days. Just rename it something else and send the matter there for resolution. So is Paradise Games saying that the Iowa and Indiana state lotteries pulled some shenanigans on bettors similar to the one pulled by Paul Newman and Robert Redford on Robert Shaw in the movie "The Sting"? The burden of proving any shenanigans is on the webshop.

ThisIsOurs 6 years, 9 months ago

"It’s not the amount of the money (that is the issue). If they won it fair and square they would have been paid yesterday on the spot.”"

Lol, "IF" they won it fair and square. Gamblers won't appreciate it, but for the average customer, these shops will take about 6,000 from them over the year and be quite happy to return 2,000-4,000 in small winnings throughout the year. And you go around to your friend telling them how this thing works and you got a cheque for 2,000 or 1,000 and you win something every week. Lol. If they have just 100 people doing that, they've made 200,000 by year end. If they get 500 people they make 1,000,000. Imagine if they got everyone in fox Hill, Bain town, the Out Islands, Pineward Gardens and Yellow Elder to do it? and all while producing absolutely nothing of value for the country, just perfecting the art of taking money from people.

Subscription services are the new business model, all the big tech companies are moving into it. They don't sell you software anymore, you have to "subscribe", they have a customer for life. The new age scammers are the MLM people, they've also adopted the model, they'll package anything into the system, gold, natural health products etc etc, but all they're doing is trying to get you to "subscribe", give them x amount of dollars every month, forever.

In and of itself subscription is not a bad thing if you're getting value, but these guys just give you part of the money you gave them. Lol. They can even afford to give one person a big 180,000 payout, it's other people money anyway.

Churches are in on it too!! Now they preach a gospel of giving more than 10%, that's your "seed". Then every so often someone "wins", they get a car or house paid off and everyone says well I better keep up my "seed", I might win too. My poor gullible Bahamians

Reality_Check 6 years, 9 months ago

The criminal numbers bosses are nothing but crooked money changers....they change 'your' money into 'their' money.....they prey on the less educated, the poor and those who have compulsive disorders that make them vulnerable to addictive behaviour. Minnis must have made a financial pact with these evil monsters who are sucking our economy dry, because so far he hasn't done a single thing aimed at repealing all of the web shop gaming legislation and introducing a national lottery. In the meantime, Minnis and Turnequest should at least be attempting to tax these greedy super wealthy criminal enterprises to death.

licks2 6 years, 9 months ago

Bouy you mussie be Bran or some other ninny from the DNA. . .so why don't you tell us how to take them licensed and legal businesses right to operate without a massive and hugely expensive legal battle. . .ONE WHICH THE GOVERNMENT WILL AND MUST LOSE! Now you see why the Bahamian people did not want the DNA with their "knee jerk" solutions anywhere around we HOA. . . go get yinna house in order and stop talking stupid nonsense. . .get rid of them two top DNA leaders and regroup. . .the next election is only 5 years away. . .keep talking that kind of foolishness and you will see one of them other parties take the opposition position come next election. . . the days of stupid political talking are OVA! So make senseble contributions or just shut the heck up in this serious dialogue!!

ThisIsOurs 6 years, 9 months ago

No the government can't shut them down, the gate is opened. The only thing that would shut them down is for people to wake up to what's happening. Its like Asue but you only get 10% of your money back if you island lucky

Sickened 6 years, 9 months ago

These numbers criminals need to be shut down and all revenue collected prior to the PLP legitimizing them should be given to the treasury.

These number houses absolutely discuss me!!!!

Honestman 6 years, 9 months ago

They are nothing but vultures trying to peck the last bit of flesh from the skeletons of the poor and the uneducated. They are a scourge across the nation.

bismark 6 years, 9 months ago

These number houses are nothing but a drain on poor people,The Bahamas Government should have never legalized this,first it was the drug trade what destroyed our young Men,now it is numbers and gambling,everyone wants to ''WIN'.If the Government want these greedy parasites to stay in business,then tax them the way they should be taxed,after all they claims its a multi million dollar industry.Those criminals need to be audited daily,every last one of them.its a pity in this country,when all you have to do is be rich and all of a sudden you are a upright citizen,Welcome to the Bahamas. we were dubbed a Nation for Sale,now its a Nation already bought.

alfalfa 6 years, 9 months ago

I Just a thought. If the government decides to legalize recreational marijuana use, will it make the current pot dealers the authorized and exclusive outlets. One would hope not, but a precedent has been set in the numbers business, and all previous illegal businesses are now legal. You are absolutely correct, Bismark.

ThisIsOurs 6 years, 9 months ago

I believe every plant on the planet has a purpose. those hallucinogenic drugs were probably created for some anesthetic pain killing purpose, now theyre being abused. I fear that they will legalize it without understanding the full ramifications and the effects on society, without putting in the proper framework to control it and we'll end up with another massive blight on the country. Then we'll stratch our heads and say, well look at all the people making money, we can't take it back.

jus2cents 6 years, 9 months ago

No sympathy here.

You deal with crooks, don't cry when you get ripped off.

MrsPragmatic 6 years, 9 months ago

This situation is one that happened because these number houses use the USA state lotteries and don't even have to common sense to stay up to date with changes within these respective lotteries!!! In a nutshell, Iowa discontinued their instate lottery because of a MASSIVE scandal involving fraud that touched all the way to the Judicial system....and in July 1st, Iowa began using the lottery 3 ball and 4 ball numbers drawn by Indiana lottery. This was circulated via press release from midJune so I cannot understand why the "super smart number bosses" aren't privy to public information on such important changes such as lottery times etc. Now, the Bahamians who saw this and decided to capitalize on the "timing error", know full well that this number houses would eventually dispute this....this happened about 5 years ago as well with the Texas lottery.

The sad part here is that the person(s) claiming fair win are being RIDICULOUS . They know fully well that the Indiana lottery posted these numbers almost 35 minutes prior to Iowa online closing time. And if they werent so darn greedy they might have gotten away with a little $1 straight win...but no, they want 5$ straight on a 4ball!!! Fools foiled and fouled again!!

sheeprunner12 6 years, 9 months ago

Repeal the Webshops Law and Replace with a National Lottery Law ......... If these numbers cartel bosses do not want to sign up to sell National lottery tickets on commission, close their asses down ........ This is quite simple to do .......... Again - if KPT, Carl & Minnis have the BALLS

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